Species not in zoos that we'd want to see in zoos

Javen Rhinos
07-07-2008

I would like to see Javen Rhinos in zoo's.
if a zoo was to keep them, how about San Diego zoo/wild animal park or Disneys Animal Kingdom, or Prehaps even Port Lympne

07-07-2008

Completely unviable.

The wild population is so low that taking any out of the wild will eventually result in an inbred captive population (and less breeding animals available in the wild).

Disney doesn't strike me as the ideal place to keep them anyway...

07-07-2008

I'll first start answering your last remark on the botos. what you said is exactly the reason I asked the question.

I've heard several unconfirmed stories that there has been a steady stream of new animals (thus making them the only zoo that caught them on a regular basis) which would mean their longevity in that zoo isn't all that.
the breeding result is completely new to me.

as to the comparison between pelagic sharks and cetaceans: pelagics are indeed not the easiest to breed and here too a lot of import still takes place.
big difference in my opinion is the fact that those sharks born in captivity generally do well, showing a much higher survival rate than cetaceans.
but you most certainly have a good point that several large species should be really reconsidered as regular aquarium habitants. e.g. large hammerheads, threshers, tigers, ... to keep with the sharkspecies.

in regards to my comment: "yet there are no exotics known that do better in private hands." I simply mean to point out that private keepers and breeders have results with several reptile and fish species that zoos would only dream about. e.g a friend of mine practically wrote the manual on how to breed the madagascan treeboa (sanzinia madagascariensis), I know several freshwater stingray breeders and finally most seahorses in dutch zoos can be traced back to 1 single private person that breeds them.

__________________
paradisio fansite: www.vriendenvanparadisio.be

07-07-2008

This may be somewhat pedantic and - on a global scale - somewhat superfluous to this conversation but I'd like to see a greater variety of prosimian species being kept and bred, especially in the UK. Don't get me wrong, I love the species we have at the moment but (and yes, I'm slightly biased here) I reckon we need to have a greater variety among the breeding stock within the UK. I'm not talking virtual impossibilities like the indri, but perhaps a sportive or mouse lemur species, a tarsier or two, a galago...

__________________
"It seems to me that the natural world is the greatest source of excitement; the greatest source of visual beauty; the greatest source of intellectual interest. It is the greatest source of so much in life that makes life worth living. " Sir David Attenborough

07-07-2008

@forumbully: a friend of mine is currently doing her PhD on botos-maybe she knows more about the animals there. I will try to contact her, but I think she is currently in Brazil.

Re: "showing a much higher survival rate than cetaceans."
Yes and no-it depends a lot on which species we're talking about. I know of only two or three institutions that are able to keep tiger sharks alive for a longer time, while makos, blue or fox sharks didn't survive in captivity for longer periods of time. The latter can be said about several cetacean species, but there are also species which survive at least as long as the more commonly kept shark species-think f.e. of Belugas. About the survival rate: don't forget that the survival rate of cetacean offspring in the wild is often also pretty low-and unlike most sharks, they usually have only one young. So while chances are still pretty high that at least one juvenile shark of the clutch/litter makes it, for cetaceans it's a literally win-lose situation-either it survives, or You have a 100 percent loss...

Re: the private breeders-tell me about it...Muenster's successful turtle project is a great example of what a zoo and an dedicated and skilled private breeder can achieve when they join forces:
Internationales Zentrum für Schildkrötenschutz
Unfortunately, it's still a rare exception to the rule...
The reason for the obvious domination of private breeders' in the field of breeding birds, reptiles, amphibians, small exotic rodents, invertebrates... is that a) private breeders can focus on species that zoos (have to?) neglect because they are not that attractive to the main audience or because they have more and more "demanding" species like elephants or Great Apes to take care of and b) private people can get animals zoos couldn't obtain legally...But I think You know that already.

07-07-2008

I would like to see more antelope species in zoos, especially more duiker species, giant sable antelope, beira, dibatag, mountain nyala, oribi, greys bok..Unfortunately most of them are absolutly unrealistic, with a few exceptions, so maybe Ader's Duikers will come to some zoos in the near future, and there is a tiny little chance for zebra and jentinks duiker in a few years...

Yesterday I've got an old zooguidebook from Naples Zoo, it is from 1956 and has pictures of Dibatag,Phillips Dik-Dik,Beira,Oribi and Bushbok inside....All this species were kept in this zoo until the beginning of the sixties or longer. Naples had once one of the biggest collections of antelopes in the world, but it's gone.

07-07-2008

the large oceanic pelagics like tigers, mako, scalloped hammerhead, blue and of course the nemesis of all: the great white are in my opinion even more off limits than cetaceans (allthough monterey bay seems to have established a few tricks). but there are enough active shark species that do very well in captivity and show moderate reproductive numbers like the sandtiger, lemon, and various smaller species like blacktips, grey reefs, ...

on another note, sharks live as individuals and don't show parental care, unlike cetaceans and even then most sharks have a lot less offspring with a much slower growthrate than any other fish species. so I don't believe their offspring does much better in the wild than the average dolphin pup.

regarding private versus zoo breeding of reptiles. your absolutely right that they have a different focus. yet it is a shame that a lot of small species are under more pressure than the average big mammal. More cooperation between private breeders and zoos would be great, but is probably utopic.

__________________
paradisio fansite: www.vriendenvanparadisio.be

07-07-2008

"moderate reproductive numbers" is a little bit too optimistic in terms of most of the shark species You mentioned.

The main difference between the sharks' start into life is the mentioned number of animals per birth-and the dependence of the cetacean young to make it to the surface as fast as possible.

07-07-2008

I once read the proposition that instead of captive breeding of marine fish and invertebrates, there should be extractive reserves, that is protected reefs from which aquarium fish are sustainably collected and sold in return for protecting the reef.

Seemed like sensible idea, given that reefs are often destroyed for other reasons. I wonder how it is catching up?

07-07-2008

Wasn't there a quarantine station in Naples too?

07-07-2008

Zebraduiker, in this post you have many antelope species that you would want to see in captivity, actually(if you didn't know or not, sorry for this if you did. ) Beira and Phillip's Dik-Dik are being held at the Al Wabra center in Qatar, Al Wabra is also going out to collect dibatag in the future, Bushbuck are kept at Gladys Porter Zoo and a few African zoos,Jentink's Duiker at Gladys Porter ,3 Oribi antelope are kept at Johannesburg zoo in South Africa and there are about 2-3 zoos in Africa that have grysbok.....so in your post the only antelope that aren't in captivity is the Zebra Duiker, the Giant Sable, the Mountain Nyala and the Ader's Duiker

07-07-2008

I know ,Al Wabra is keeping Beira ( they are not doing well there, a lot of them died and I don't think they will send Beira to other facillities )and Phillips Dik-Dik, but Al wabra is not a zoo and not open to the public, so it's impossible to see them. The Jentinks Duiker at Brownsville is the last one in a zoo, and and the last Bushbucks at Brownsville is the last group of them outside of africa and they will die out there.

There is one Dibatag in a breeding facillity in eritrea.But its not open to the public,too.

@Okapikpr. There was an quarantine station at naples, but it is closed since many years.

07-07-2008

I believe that is why Naples Zoo had such an excellent collection of African antelope- it acted as a quarantine station for other European zoos as well due to its geographical location. Some of these species would have been 'in transit' and others more permanent exhibits. (Belle Vue in Manchester played a similar role in the UK when it was open, so did Chipperfield's Plymouth Zoo)

07-07-2008

Not so sure they are so impossible-remember that Sifakas have started appearing in collections and they were previously ranked similarly with Indris as 'impossible' but now have proved they are not.

08-07-2008

indeed, the number of pelagic shark breedings could be a lot better if you're looking at the aquaria that keep them. I'm afraid this has nothing to do with difficulty to breed them. but with the attitude of those aquaria. a lot of the animals end up in cramped tanks where they live short lives. I know of several well renowned institutions in Europe that have new blacktips every 6 months!

I seem to remember that the problem with young cetaceans both in the wild and captivity is not breathing after birth but health problems in the first months.

@Jurek7: the reef principle you describe is used mostly for clams, anemones, soft corals and other inverts.
one of the latest development in collecting fish is imitating floating nurseries where larvae of surgeonfish, wrasses, ... gather and grow. these are regularly harvested and the animals found are reared to a certain size. after that part goes to the aquarium trade and part is released into the wild. not yet a common technique, but you see more and more of these "micro-fish" in aquarium shops.

__________________
paradisio fansite: www.vriendenvanparadisio.be